Discuss cdraina's Tier 1 (General) USCIS Case

Tier 1 (General) case:
India
India
04 Jul 2007
09 Jul 2007
85
10 Jul 2007
11 Jul 2007
2226**
denied
30 Jul 2007
08 Aug 2007
26 days
30 Nov -0001
08 Aug 2007
HO doesn't accept TOEFL. Denied due to English Language Requirement.


Watch this case

Watch this case
If you watch this case, we will notify you every time the applicant updates the case details, or when a user adds a comment to it.
Users currently watching this case: NastyKid, mycanal 40 Comments

Posted by cdraina
09 Jul 2007 #1
Hi friends,

I submitted my appplication on 4th July. As a proof of past earnings I attached my IT return and Salary slips.

I did not send any earning grid (mentioned on most blogs). Does that affect my chances?

Thanks,
CD
Posted by kumcy
09 Jul 2007 #2
Hi,

Mostly It will not affect. But it will take some time for them to process your application.
Moreover if they need some queries to clarify with you, then they will use your e-mail / phone numbers provided by you.
So please check those things are perfect.
Ask them your status via e-mail or phone. I used email and they responed in 2 hours immediately.

regards,
kumcy
Posted by cdraina
10 Jul 2007 #3
Application Submitted: 4th July
Application reached HO: 9th July
Fee debited: 10th July
Posted by cdraina
10 Jul 2007 #4
Hi kumcy,

Thanks!

What email did you write to?

Regards,
Chakshu
Posted by kumcy
10 Jul 2007 #5
Hi Chakshu,

Just write to this Email id [email protected]

Also check with your local post office as in my case they didnt posted to my house and i went and collected in person.

regards
Kumcy
Posted by cdraina
11 Jul 2007 #6
Application Submitted: 4th July
Application reached HO: 9th July
Fee debited: 10th July
Got Reference Number and Payment confirmation: 11th July
Posted by cdraina
15 Jul 2007 #7
Hi Friends,

Please confirm if the Home Office calls applicant's employer in all cases. I haven't informed my employer about it, I would be in trouble.

Thanks,
CD
Posted by cdraina
23 Jul 2007 #8
Hi Forum,
Called HO on July 23rd, my case is waiting to be allocated to a case worker.

Planning to send more documents. I have sent ITR, salary slips and Form 16 with my application. Since ITR is not being considered by HSMP team, I am planning to send Bank Statements.

If any one has an experience of sending additional documents after sending the application please share it with us.

Cheers!
CD
Posted by dalmeida
23 Jul 2007 #9
Hi,

I sent across my IELTS certificate after submitting my application. I called to let them know that I was doing this. They don't have a problem with this as long as your case has not been assigned to a caseworker as yet. I also called them after sending the doc to make sure that they had received it and that it had been linked to my application. Better safe than sorry!!

Also, it's easier to call them as opposed to emailing them. You need to wait for quite a while before getting through, but you get immediate answers to your queries and they're very helpful.

Cheers
DA
Posted by cdraina
26 Jul 2007 #10
Called HO on 26th. The automated system says " Currently working on applications received on 28th June". Looks like they are not keen on updating that announcement. I sent my application on 9th July and the case worker is assigned. I have sent additional documents that have reached HO, but not yet linked to my file.

Application Submitted: 4th July
Application reached HO: 9th July
Fee debited: 10th July
Got Reference Number and Payment confirmation: 11th July
Sent additional documents: 23rd July
Assigned to caseworker: 26th July

Wish me luck friends!

Cheers!
CD
Posted by chennai
27 Jul 2007 #11
Hae Chaksu!

All the best! Hope you hear the good news soon...
me too in the same dates like you.

regards,
Chennai boy
Posted by srivuppala
29 Jul 2007 #12
can any body tell the address to send the additional documents after sending the HSMP application intially.

They recieved an application on 26/07/2007 and amount debited on 26/07/2007 from my bank.

I didnot recieve the reference number yet to my email id. i will email them to have the reference number.

I have one query. I didnot provide the ORIGINAL DEGREE certifice for my PG since there is a name correction on it. I provided the alternative documents ORIGINAL ACADEMIC and ORIGINAL TRANSCRIPT to substantiate it. the reason of applying in this month itself is, my eligible 20 points for the age gets completed end of this month to reach 75 points.

may i know the exact meaning of ORIGINAL ACADEMIC REFERENCE.. I got the academic reference from the college. is it correct way to get from the college.
the letter contains year of passing, studied in the which university and secured class etc. which is signed by the principal of the college.
Please update me ASAP. awaiting for your kind reply.
Posted by cdraina
30 Jul 2007 #13
Hi,

My timelines:

Application Submitted: 4th July
Application reached HO: 9th July
Fee debited: 10th July
Got Reference Number and Payment confirmation: 11th July
Sent additional documents: 23rd July
Assigned to caseworker: 25th July
Additional documents reached HO: 26th July

I called HO today. The representative informed me that the case-worker is waiting for my additional documents. As mentioned above, the additional documents reached HO on 26th July. The representative mentioned that she has no information if the additional documents have been linked to the application.

Then I requested her to connect to the case worker. She gently denied the request and suggested me to wait for a few WEEKS.

Most people around my timeline have got their decisions, and I am pretty nervous now. Experienced folks, please suggest, what should be my next step?


Cheers!
CD
Posted by purushotham
31 Jul 2007 #14
Hi CD Raina, thought of calling you,
if possible leave me ur number
in my mail ID
[email protected]
Posted by chennai
31 Jul 2007 #15
Hi Chaksu,
I am sorry to hear the decision. wait till the paper comes in hand.
I am afraid to make a call to know about my status.......
regards,
ChennaiBoy
Posted by cdraina
31 Jul 2007 #16
I had a refusal due to English language criteria.

I submitted a valid TOEFL score (290/300) with my application. The following link on Working in the UK mention that TOEFL is an acceptable score (please see Question 39 in FAQ):

http://www.workingintheuk.gov.uk/working_in_the_uk/EN/homepage/schemes_and_programmes/hsmp/hsmp_faq.html?

I will request for a review.

Cheers!
CD
Posted by NastyKid
03 Aug 2007 #17
HI CDR

I think issue was not the toefl, but your degree certificate.You need to provide the original certificate.If you have problems with it , best thing is to fix the issue and re apply.Because what the HO does is, according to a guide line, and the case workers have their own guidelines.The dicesion is made by a panel, and not individualy by a single case worker.If there are issues on that , they discuss and decide that.

So better request for a review if you know 100% the case was toefl.
other wise you may have to re apply , once the case reach the case worker I dnt think they will let you add any thing to the case, unless caseworker requested.

You cannot speak to Case workers by the way, there are governing code of conduct for them :)


good luck with the next stage
Posted by cdraina
03 Aug 2007 #18
Dear NK,

My refusal letter says " Your TOEFL is not considered equivalent to IELTS 6"

I had sent original degree certificate, so no issues with that. Btw I have been awared 80 points (including 35 for my qualification). So definitely no issue with the degree.

Lets see what happens in review.

Cheers!
CD
Posted by NastyKid
03 Aug 2007 #19
Hi CD

You are almost there, its been very silly of them not to accept TOEFL as all most every UK university , does that.Its a good case you have High Lighted,

Fingers cross , you should get it as they may further discuss it, as you said , you have a strong case ( FAQ 39) , It is their dault not to mention the level of TOEFL which they would expect.So you have already won the battle.Did you tell them , that " it is not mentioned any where , that you would need a particular standard, for you case on toefl to be accepted I.E. FAQ 39)

All the best , the worst case you still can get the bloody cabridge TOEFL, all these are ways of spending money for their cause.
being in this country for 5 years studied every thing here in UK, still I had to do it for the sake of the requirement.(didnt want to give them a chance at all regarding HSMP)


All the very best

NastyKid
Posted by cdraina
04 Aug 2007 #20
I wrote to HO and they are not even ready to take a call on the incident.

Here's the mail that I wrote to HO guys and their VERY HELPFUL response:


MY MAIL:
=============================================
Dear HSMP Team,

Greetings!

My application details are as follows:

Full Name: XYZ
Reference number: 222XXX
Date of Birth: XXXX

I understand that my application was unsuccessful on the ground that my
TOEFL certificate was not considered an acceptable standard to satisfy
the English Language criteria. I have a TOEFL score of 290/300 and I
believe that such a score would be equivalent to a score of 6 on IELTS.

The following FAQ page on your website (Question No. 39) clearly
mentions that TOEFL is an acceptable certificate for HSMP
applications:
[url]
http://www.workingintheuk.gov.uk/working_in_the_uk/EN/homepage/schemes_a
nd_programmes/hsmp/hsmp_faq.html?
[/url]

I understand that Home Office has recently started accepting TOEFL
certificates. Hence applications with TOEFL may not be as common, with
the caseworkers, as the applications with IELTS are. This perfectly
justifies the error in evaluation of my case.

I would request you to please suggest me how should this may be brought
to the notice of caseworkers and what should be my next steps?

Kind regards,

Applicant

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


MAIL FROM HO
=============================================
Dear Applicant,

If you feel that your application was wrongly assessed, you may now
apply for a review. The review request form can be downloaded from our
website and faxed to the below number. Reviews must be received within
28 days of the date on your decision letter.

Regards,

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
Posted by cdraina
04 Aug 2007 #21
Hi NK,

After the above mentioned reply from HO I am not very hopeful. The logic seems to be missing at HO.

I may not re-apply soon if my review decision is unsuccessful.

Cheers!
CD
Posted by NastyKid
05 Aug 2007 #22
Hi CD

DO not try to call them or contact them.
Use the lines such as review and make your case.
Dont be in a position to say They did a Mistake

"Hence applications with TOEFL may not be as common, with
the caseworkers, as the applications with IELTS are. This perfectly
justifies the error in evaluation of my case."

because I do understand people do make mistakes on understanding your case.
But there are no mistakes in the guidelines(as far as I know)
because case worker guidelines are practical applications of law.It is not a individual who make the decision.
So what you should do is make the review requesr fax to them
in that
"please carefully mention why you think your case should be considered on the basis of faq (39)
AND BRING YOUR POINT SUCH AS "IT IS NOT MENTIONED ANY WHERE , THERE IS A MINIMUM CONDITION EXCEPTED FOR TOEFL
.I have got 290/300 , Which i think is perfectly acceptable , If you consider Toefl as a proof of required language skills.

If toefl is considered , I kindly request you to consider my application on the basis of 290/300 oppose to 6/9 in IELTS.
if it is not the case and else where it is mentioned a minimum condition for TOEFL , please do advice me , so that i can produce , the required IELTS.


Hope this will help

be positive and fingers cross,dont try to contact them ,(its not gonna happen in this country)follow the procedured, and you will be fine
good luck
Nasty Kid
Posted by NastyKid
05 Aug 2007 #23
After the above mentioned reply from HO I am not very hopeful. The logic seems to be missing at HO.

dont come to that conclusion, there is a board who take a decision ,and there are rules to support them.What you need to do id to make sure there is no guideline that quantify the TOEFL out their in hsmp GUIDELINES

If there is a guideline , saying 2according to section xxx, part yyy , an applicant need to have minimum od x amount of toefl for thier HSMP language requirements, then the best advice is book ieltd ASAP and re apply

:)
Posted by cdraina
05 Aug 2007 #24
Hi NK,

I totally agree with your point that no value in talking about news/notice on other websites.

Did you mean to say TOEFL should be considered equivalent only if it is mentioned on the HOME OFFICE website?
Have a look at "Q. No. 39" in the FAQ section of HOME OFFICE website:

http://www.workingintheuk.gov.uk/working_in_the_uk/EN/homepage/schemes_and_programmes/hsmp/hsmp_faq.html?

I have a score of 290 out of 300, with 100% score in 3 out of 4 sections. Now given the equivalence of IELTS and TOEFL, I can't believe that such a TOEFL score could not be pegged equal to a grade 6 or IELTS.

Cheers!
CD
Posted by ramumorla
05 Aug 2007 #25
cdraina,

Just apply for review, before the time is out, Your case will be approved
Posted by NastyKid
06 Aug 2007 #26
Good afteernoon from a very gloomy London,

faq(39)
Do TOEFL (Test of English as a Foreign Language) English language qualifications satisfy the English Language requirements for HSMP?
Yes, TOEFL certificates satisfy the English language criteria where they are of a level equivalent to IELTS level 6 and were awarded prior to you making your application.

1) They accept it
2) there is no mark such as IELTS 6 , so

request them to consider your case on the basis of these 2 arguments plus, you can ask them if 290/300 is not good enough , what amount they accept , and where else it is mentioned

So you have you say

P.S I have no idea why you did TOEFL, may be you would have been planning US

Good luck
Posted by cdraina
06 Aug 2007 #27
NK,

You are right, wrote TOEFL a year back to University Admissions (In US). Dropped that plan so tried to use the score here. I regret, have put my 400 GBP at stake and am loosing precious time.

:(

thanks,
CD
Posted by cdraina
08 Aug 2007 #28
Papers have finally come.

The reason for refusal is as follows:

"Your TOEFL comprises of three sections: Reading, listening, writing. For it to be equivalent to IELTS, we would require an additional SPEAKING section testing."

So I don't stand a chance in the review as well. I think I should better write IELTS.

I wonder what are the options for vocally dumb (mute) Higly Skilled individual???
Posted by ramumorla
08 Aug 2007 #29
What about your Graduation? Is it not English Medium? if it is Just go get a certificate to that effect from university/ Institur=tion
Posted by NastyKid
08 Aug 2007 #30
If yor first degree is in english medium get it certified by uni and send them
.also dont forget to get it certified by naric (dont know what they are up to)

It is sad, But Good Luck , get a cd and a book
apply ASAP, cos january its gonna be tough
Posted by ramumorla
08 Aug 2007 #31
NAIRC is not required, if the university is recognised by UGC in India....And the Degree is taught in English- Getting the certificate needs an investment of 2-3 K rupees, Easiest.. Dont waste time in NAIRC and IELTS etc...
Posted by NastyKid
08 Aug 2007 #32
Mate

"recognised by UGC in India." doesnt apply here.Each of the applications are just another case for a case worker.
I will only agree with you if "recognised by UGC in India." is part of the immigration rules here.

Dont spend another 400£ give them another point to refuse
It is our responsibility to make sure nothing goes wrong and every thing is according to the applicant guidelines/1971 immigrations/case worker manual bla bla.

You can experiment if you have money/or shortcuts
but Dont blame NastyKid

I have been in this country enough to find what is accepted and whats not
just trying to give some one advice, with out donating money for a lawyer
lol

Good Luck

After all

case workers do not care even if it is from Oxford or Cambridge
Trust me, and the other thing is they will not care our degrees no matter how good they are at most time
This is my first hand experience.
If you dont believe me, Come and join the party

Good luck to all
Posted by ramumorla
08 Aug 2007 #33
Nastykid,
Please please do not misguide, read the guidance, properly, follow as it is and it will be approved. BTW UGC approved university degree taught in English medium is accepted by Any case worker in HOME office and just like you I am also in this country, enough time to understand how it works. Again, Please do not misguide- Let me make it clear with One caveat, If your Degree is taught in english medium and the university is recognised, by UGC in India, every Damn governemnt organisation which does not belong to either a terrorist country or acountry under dictatorship, will recognise, and trust me UK even though is driven by processes as it is, it is one of the best countries to live and work, and respects people. AGAIN GUYS, PLEASE DONOT MISGUIDE PEOPLE
Posted by cdraina
08 Aug 2007 #34
Cool it off friends!

I am not re-applying. Thanks for the suggestions though.

Cheers!
CD
Posted by NastyKid
09 Aug 2007 #35
hey

Good for you Mate,
If you think I Miss guide, go ahead.

(A) "by UGC in India, every Damn governemnt organisation which does not belong to either a terrorist country or acountry under dictatorship, will recognise, "

(B) "BTW UGC approved university degree taught in English medium is accepted by Any case worker in HOME office"

This is the guideline on April 2007
"Introduction and Points available
2. In this category you can score the following
points according to the highest level
educational qualifications you hold:
PhD Masters Bachelors
50 35 30
3. Qualifications have to meet the recognised
standard of UK Bachelors, Masters or PhD (as
verified by the current National Academic
Recognition Information Centre (NARIC)
database), to be awarded the respective
points.
4. Vocational and professional qualifications can
also score points in this area if satisfactory
independent evidence is produced to show
that the qualification is equivalent to an
applicable level UK academic qualification.
This will be verified, where possible, by
reference to the NARIC database or the
relevant professional body. It is the
responsibility of the applicant to demonstrate
that the qualification equates to a UK
academic qualification. You should obtain
evidence that the qualification equates to an
appropriate British level academic qualification
and submit this evidence with your
application."

What I was telling was how we get treated here ,If you beleive it.thats very good.But We cannot assume That it will happen
Its not a miss guide, and all What I am saying is They will accept any thing with in the guidelines.But looking an CD's case , its profoundly not true isnt it?

From our side we need to make sure That they dont take piss as we were from out side UK.
My point is not about miss leading any one go shit's sake,Its about poor people sepnding 400£ and then realise ooh shit I co
Posted by cdraina
13 Sep 2007 #36
Got my IELTS result today!

Got 8.5 on 9.

Thinking about re-applying before the laws change :)
Posted by NastyKid
15 Sep 2007 #37
CD

Congrats.

Well as you can understand this is all about picking the right ball.Please do apply ASAP.Also read http://www.trackitt.com/discussion-forums/hsmp-application/10401263/
which is bit nasty.

Apparently Nasty kid has to go back home and was garnted EC with in 48 hours of submission.

So I am sure you know the rules here, go for it

Good Luck

Nasty Kid
Posted by cdraina
28 Sep 2007 #38
Hi Friends,

Got a refusal recently. Have applied for a second time. Attached is my cover letter. Do you see any issues here??

===================================

HSMP Team,
Border and Immigration Agency
7th Floor, Fountain Precinct
Balm Green, Sheffield
S1 2JA

28th September 2007

Dear HSMP Team,

SUBJECT: Application for Highly Skilled Migrant Programme

This letter is with reference to my enclosed application for the UK Highly Skilled Migrant Programme (HSMP). To assist my application assessment, I am explaining the evidences I am providing for the ‘points’ claimed.

Enclosures (in the following order):

1. HSMP Application Form

2. Academic Qualifications: (For 35 Points Claimed)
a. Original Degree Certificate stating that a Master of Business Administration (MBA) was awarded by "XXXXX"

3. Previous Earnings – Salaried Employment: (For 25 Points Claimed)
I have claimed 25 points for the gross income (INR 460,219 or about GBP 5,402) earned by me from 27th Sep 2006 to 31st Mar 2007. As per Annex-C of HSMP guidelines I am providing the following evidences.
a. Income Tax Return (ITR) for the financial year 2006-07. Actual employment/earning period covered under the ITR was 27th Sep 2006 to 31st Mar 2007. The total earning for the period was INR 462,418, which includes cash salary earnings of INR 460,219 and other salary perquisites of INR 2,199. I am claiming a salaried earning of INR 460,219, as further substantiated by my wage slips.
b. Wage Slips from Oct-2006 to 30-April-2007 (covering the entire amount mentioned in IT return)
c. Banks Statements for the period 01-Oct-2006 to 10-May-2007
d. Form 16 – Certificate of earning from my employer

4. Age Assessment: (For 20 Points Claimed)
a. Driving License

5. English Language:
a. Original IELTS TRF Overall Band Score 8.5

Total Points Claimed – 80 Points

In addition to the above-mentioned documents, I am enclosing a copy of your
Posted by NastyKid
28 Sep 2007 #39
Hey CD

Nice to see you are back

This is spot on, as you can see Nasty kid is running the forum now,.
As you have all your home work done , this looks fine to me.

If you have any other stuff, drop in a line

We may be able to help you

GoodLuck and dont give them another chance


NastyKid
Posted by cdraina
07 Oct 2007 #40
My SECOND HSMP Case

http://www.trackitt.com/discuss/hsmpi/4645691/

Add a comment

When you add a comment, (1) we will notify the applicant so he/she can respond, and (2) you will begin to watch this case.